Well, gang, here we go again. Last time, I talked on Kvothe’s Sex Life, I had only finished NOTW and started WMF. Having finished WMF, I got a flurry of questions about sex and literature and “where do babies come from” and “go ask your parents, they’ll hate me if I tell you” and so forth.
Since then, I keep returning to a handful of themes. (1) Rothfuss, as charitable and joyful as he is, would not call himself a Christian from what I’ve gathered on his blog. Because of this, it’s not helpful for Christians to super-impose theology on his books. (2) However, the man has a robust idea of what redemption is/isn’t and how resurrection plays out. He certainly expresses those opinions in the legends inside his books and in Kvothe in general. Because of this, I learn all sorts of things from him. (3) In light of these two, Christians keep asking me what I do with all the sexuality. Since Literating is a diverse place, I’ll do what I can to hit both sides of the fence, although it’s a sticky question. There will be spoilers, so if you haven’t read the book, you should not continue reading.
After a romp through the rainy tent-sheets, Kvothe comes out the other side of the enemy encampment saying I do not believe in faeries. Which, by the way, gave me chills. I yelled from the sixth floor of an Upper West Side apartment building, “IT JUS GOT SUHRIOUS!” In retrospect, it had just gotten voluptuous, but who’s keeping score?
Here’s the question too keep at the forefront of your mind:
How was Kvothe able to name Felurian?
He was a virgin. Think about it: young orphan, fledgling namer, misses his momma, girl he loves acts like a selas flower and the wind combined, he’s sixteen, horny, blah blah blah. Got it?
She was a fae, and not just any fae, but the fae who lured you in through sensuality, forced you to indulge in the lust of the flesh and exploded your heart from the inside out through… well… you get the picture. In other words, she’s like lust incarnate.
Virgin. Lust incarnate. Virgin. Lust incarnate. See the contrast? Virgins tend to stand for more than just sexually abstained whatever in novels, they tend to stand for innocence, purity and the rest. When this virgin, the hero of the story, gives himself away to lust incarnate you might normally infer what would be seen in stories like Faerie Queen by Spencer – that the dude just got seduced. But why the control?
Felurian, until that moment, killed men who had been around the bases a time or two. Every other man who came to her died in her arms through an appetite unquenched. Not Kvothe. Kvothe’s a virgin, and when he went to her, he had the chance (especially as a namer) to see her as she was, all of her, inside and out, spirit and body, before and after. He sings four lines of a song, names her, and so does what no man could: I stayed the night with Felurian and left with both my sanity and my life.
That’s power, and it may or may not say something about the spiritual side of sex. In addition, it climaxes (quite literally – and yes, I do think he meant that as a subtle inside joke) the Albedo, giving Kvothe the greatest enlightenment he could receive for his sleeping mind. He now named a Fae, and the Faeland is the easiest way to get at your sleeping mind. Thus Elodin’s jealousy of the shaed.
So yeah, as a Christian I’m totally cool with that scene. I’d just put a footnote on the imagery, and meditate on it for some time.
As for the Adem, they have this philosophy that sex is just like eating or sleeping, that fighting is more intimate, singing even more so. Though I could go into worship as intimacy or my personal experience in MMA and the intimacy in that, I’ll just point out the line that comes before the fall, “be fruitful and increase in number.” Some theologians ask the question, “if sex could be emptied of all selfishness, sin, manipulation and abuse – could there be sex, even communal sex, in the new heavens and new earth?”
Because of the nature of people, this sounds like paganism or Islam or whatever, but that’s not what I’m asking. I’m saying that I have a category for the Adem, a category for their philosophy, a hook to hang my hat on.
As for the other girls in between Felurian and the Adem (and after), I got nothing. For this (as many of my other friends outside the Christian circle would suggest), I think Rothfuss just made a horny character that went from woman to woman. Again, he’s not a christian, so it neither surprises nor bothers me that he writes that way. I’m thankful, because of my personal convictions and wiring, that he dealt with each of these in passing, with tact, poetry, and an utter lack of crass language (something that many many many other writers miss out on).
Be that as it may, I stand by my original assessment. Ari’s too innocent. Devi’s too dangerous. Fela’s not Denna and Denna’s too evasive. Kvothe will have none of them, 5 to 1 odds against.
Any takers?
I am not particularly interested in Kvothe’s sex life outside of his time with Felurian. He makes a deal with her and promises to return. He cleverly manipulates her pride. Then he ends up knowing her name. When he goes out into the world I would say that he is curious. “Unless I leave and taste the fruits mortal women have to offer, I’ll never know how skilled you truly are.”
However skilled Felurian is…he is not in love with her. He is in love with Denna. The Cthaeh taunts him about this. Maybe they never have sex. Maybe they do. I don’t think anybody else really matters to him the way Denna does with her “perfect mouth” etc. I guess I don’t understand why anyone wants to ask who he will have sex with in the next book. He is in love with Denna at this point. Whatever happens, it is what occurs between Kvothe and Denna that will end up being significant.
I think it a pointless exercise to rule out who he will or will not have sex with in the next book.
Yeah, me neither, but apparently the online world is. The two kvothe’s posts got nearly 200 hits yesterday alone (not to mention the other stuff), so I figured if people are asking about it, why not writes something up.
I like your second bit. I agree with you entirely, that the relationship between the two is significant for the STORY not for the sexuality, however I would define it as “platonic” and in the strictest sense: it is a shadow of things to come, a symbol of his interaction with the wind, naming & the Chandrian.
As for the last, my only point is to eliminate the discussion by nipping it in the bud. I, like you, really do not care and hope that we can move past it onto greater things by admitting that, as of right now, neither of the four look promising and THEREFORE must not be the main point/storyline he’s driving at.
Hi: Off topic here….
Does most of the discussion happen here or on Facebook?
Alos, I just watched “Winter’s Bone” not a great PR film for Southern MO! Yikes.
Well, two responses:
1. most of the discussion happens by word of mouth, tweets or here: http://asoiaf.westeros.org/index.php/topic/48993-the-wise-mans-fear-iv/
2. I actually think it’s good press for different reasons. Yeah, the plot makes it look like the ozarks are bunch of meth-addicted mass murderers, but when you consider that the guys who made it were from missouri, that the locations were all missouri and that it got nominated for an oscar (at least I think it did with that Time article back during oscar season), I think we’ll see a lot more quality films come out of the midwest. Hipsters are getting tired of seeing so much city in films, or at least so much touristy city in films.
I just thought of another point regarding Denna. Bast knows what she looked like. So, there is some Denna/Fae interaction in the next book. Also, Kvothe has promised to return to Felurian. Are these connected?
Many speculate that Bast is Kvothe’s son. What if he’s Denna’s?
HOLY CRAP YOU’RE RIGHT! I never thought about that before… That’s a really solid observation!
I’ve heard that Bast is some sort of Fae prince, but I’ve no clue where that came from. Thoughts?
In NOTW Bast is introduced to the Chronicler as “Bastas son of Remmen, Prince of Twilight and the Telwyth Mael” (93)
He is 150 years old and has been with Kvothe for two. But time is different in faerie.
Bast says he has seen Denna, Kvothe says Bast has seen her once. NOTW (382)
right. that’s the piece I’m talking about. How do you know the two years thing?
Right, I remember that. Hmm…. interesting.
I think Kvothe mentions Bast’s age and two years as his student on page 93 or thereabouts.
I think you are correct about Kvothe’s virginity. It is also why he was allowed to leave faerie.
Thanks. It makes sense to me.
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Yes, it was nominated! I just got the wimmety wim wams watching it because of my job. It involves abused and neglected children.
It was well made, I would like to see another film of the area that is a paean to the natural beauty in the area along with a compelling story. I’ve never been to Missouri. I had a thought that it is pretty, but this was the wrong movie for that!
what was nominated? I missed something somewhere… winter’s bone?
[...] not easy to recognize Dante’s Inferno inside the movie Inception or the significance of a sex-scene in the middle of a New York Times bestseller or the intentionality of a piece of jewelry in a movie. I mean that. Those things don’t come [...]
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[...] at the end of book one, Kvothe calls the wind. In book two, when faced with the masculine need to refuse the feminine Felurian, Kvothe imprisons her in wind and then names her. Shortly after, when Kvothe [...]
[...] sex – Enough with the kinky sex crap. I make one post with the word sex in it and people go [...]
I think your wrong auri’s to shy devi,s too broken fela is with sim but he will have denna
I’d like to think that, but then again, why would he be so emotionally train wrecked? Rothfuss seems to suvert story with story, so I’m wondering how he’s critiquing “happily ever after” ? Maybe the hero really doesn’t always get the girl…
Thanks for stopping by, Chris.